Tuesday, 28 June 2011

Tuesday Discussion Chatlog

I appologise for the wrong time given on the blog for today's discussion.  this goes to show - we need more people taking responsibility for stuff in SLLU!  Contact me inworld if you have time you can spare for the good of the Unity Group!

[2011/06/28 07:07] Plot Tracer: The discussion today is, “Where is globalisation going to take us after the crisis in capitalism – further socialising debt among the poor and working, or socialising wealth and power amongst all?"

[2011/06/28 07:07] Plot Tracer: I was watching Glastonbury this week and there was a huge event took place, largely unreported and that was - protestors were arrested for trying to inflate a balloon that had on it, "Bono Pay Your Taxes"
[2011/06/28 07:08] David Endrizzi: crap, did my daughter get arrested
[2011/06/28 07:08] Lea56 Hyun: So much "real" news we don't get:-(
[2011/06/28 07:09] Plot Tracer: and he described the high rate of tax he paid in the UK as "fuedal."

[2011/06/28 07:09] Plot Tracer: Also, the Singer, Adele, has said recently she hates the fact she pays so much tax.
[2011/06/28 07:09] Plot Tracer: Now, what made me angry was
[2011/06/28 07:09] Sophiekittycat Resident: i would love to pay a lot of taxes it means i have monney lol
[2011/06/28 07:09] Plot Tracer: that all of these people, if they were taxed 1/2 of their capital they would all have enough money to never work again and every day, i see people struggle to buy medicine or clothe themselves or feed their kids
[2011/06/28 07:10] Plot Tracer: this world has limited resources and
[2011/06/28 07:11] Lea56 Hyun: Listens and nods to Plot in agreement
[2011/06/28 07:11] Plot Tracer: if the wealthy keep getting wealthy, and as is happening, the poor keep getting poorer, we will have one class of people scrabbling to survive in fenced off zones, and another class of people with all the freedoms that want to move, and enjoy themselves
[2011/06/28 07:11] Sophiekittycat Resident: this world dont have so much limited resources but most are wasted for a small number

[2011/06/28 07:11] Plot Tracer: is this far from where we are?
[2011/06/28 07:11] Plot Tracer: also sorry - i will finish on thisand allow others to speak – but ideologies seem to be letting us down. the alternative to poverty and austerity IS there. The debt, the burden CAN be borne by the rich and they would stay rich but
[2011/06/28 07:13] Plot Tracer: what is happening is the poor are taking on the rich man/womans debt
[2011/06/28 07:14] Plot Tracer: is this fair? And shoud our left political parties be saying more about what we want for a future world instead of just speaking and rallying to keep what little we have? Has ideology been killed by the soviet Union and its promise for a golden future failing?
[2011/06/28 07:14] Plot Tracer: OK I'll open up the floor (any later arrivals i will put the opener on a notecard)

[2011/06/28 07:15] Adur Gaelyth: I agree with you Plot
[2011/06/28 07:15] Lea56 Hyun: not far at all I think and of course here in the US, Obama is blocked everytime he tries to remedy it in some way:-(
[2011/06/28 07:15] Snow Wolfhunter: yes, the truth is that todays order does that, but in all fair, if you can make it qork for your self - you have created something, you can go up, as well.. afcours, it horrible that some peopel are starving, while others can visit the moon on fridays, but i doubt things will stay as this forever

[2011/06/28 07:16] Lea56 Hyun: not far i mean from your last statement about the polarization of rich and poor
[2011/06/28 07:16] Snow Wolfhunter: younger generations have different views of future world, and sooner or later, they will be leaders of it
[2011/06/28 07:16] IM: amadeus Belgar: well capitalism isnt good at even wealth distribution,,,its a jungle
[2011/06/28 07:17] David Endrizzi: president obama has proved himself too much a centrist pacifier to be effective
[2011/06/28 07:17] Lea56 Hyun: well best we have at the moment anyway, David, he probably found out when he actually got to DC what overwhelming odds are against his ideals
[2011/06/28 07:17] Snow Wolfhunter: for example - in my country, lately theres talk about kindergardens payment - that richer people need to pay more, that hasnt been the deal before, everyone payed same, and now evryones spitting one evryone, since in my conutry diffrence beetven rich and poor.. aint big
[2011/06/28 07:18] amadeus Belgar: ell capitalism isnt good at even wealth distribution,,,its a jungle

[2011/06/28 07:18] Adur Gaelyth: anyway I think this capitalist system will collapse in a few years
[2011/06/28 07:18] Snow Wolfhunter: all of them do
[2011/06/28 07:18] Snow Wolfhunter: this one will as well
[2011/06/28 07:18] Snow Wolfhunter: system grows, as we grow
[2011/06/28 07:18] Lea56 Hyun: I don't think it ever will, not in USA, anyway, Adur, too deeply engrained in even the youngest of us
[2011/06/28 07:18] amadeus Belgar: well prob not
[2011/06/28 07:19] amadeus Belgar: young folk not polticised enough in UK yet
[2011/06/28 07:19] Snow Wolfhunter: really? here, we have lately more and more movements in young people groups
[2011/06/28 07:19] Snow Wolfhunter: they want better
[2011/06/28 07:19] Sophiekittycat Resident: the capitalism as effective economic system will fail and crash but i fear that we go more and more toward a rule of economic interests over the politic

[2011/06/28 07:19] amadeus Belgar: yes
[2011/06/28 07:19] Plot Tracer: yes sophie - or
[2011/06/28 07:20] Sophiekittycat Resident: people do nothing they accept a, and as when in, span there is a small revolt it not grow there is no solidarity
[2011/06/28 07:20] amadeus Belgar: cos of globilisations which made business and capital too important
[2011/06/28 07:20] Plot Tracer: should we as political activists be saying much more about what sort of world we want?
[2011/06/28 07:20] amadeus Belgar: sure should
[2011/06/28 07:20] Lea56 Hyun: Absolutely, Plot
[2011/06/28 07:20] Adur Gaelyth: deeply engrained? maybe... but when people start really starving to death in the US... as it will probably happen if everything goes on like this... then there will be changes
[2011/06/28 07:21] amadeus Belgar: 30million on food relief in US
[2011/06/28 07:21] Plot Tracer: i agree Adur

[2011/06/28 07:21] Lea56 Hyun: wow, I know, Master, I had to be when I was a poor student
[2011/06/28 07:22] amadeus Belgar: americans have a third world poor inside their own borders
[2011/06/28 07:22] Sophiekittycat Resident: europe will cut by 5 food help to it own poors
[2011/06/28 07:22] Plot Tracer: So, what can we do positively?
[2011/06/28 07:22] Sophiekittycat Resident: us alone nothing
[2011/06/28 07:22] Snow Wolfhunter: nods
[2011/06/28 07:22] Adur Gaelyth: I think all we can do is wait
[2011/06/28 07:22] amadeus Belgar: well strike soon in UK
[2011/06/28 07:22] Sophiekittycat Resident: as long as people will stay egoist in corporatist egoisms we will be preys
[2011/06/28 07:23] amadeus Belgar: political processes not working...need non violent protest
[2011/06/28 07:23] Sophiekittycat Resident: non violent protests are political
[2011/06/28 07:23] Sophiekittycat Resident: all is political
[2011/06/28 07:24] Snow Wolfhunter: people who have money, love their money, and when they give it away - its pressed world wide, but the truth is,.. that every each one of us, daily, weeky, monthly gives a stranger a couple of bucks as he sees him on the street, when they come to yolur home, but.. when you dont have a lot of money, its hard to divide it
[2011/06/28 07:24] Plot Tracer: should we just wait? today, Greeks arent just waiting to allow their Govt impose more auserity/ job losses/ pay cuts etc on them - they are taking to the streets. What can we as individuals/ small groups etc do?
[2011/06/28 07:24] Sophiekittycat Resident: problem is that most of people no more have politic awareness
[2011/06/28 07:24] amadeus Belgar: well yes

[2011/06/28 07:24] Adur Gaelyth: big changes are coming.... oil peak will change absolutely everything
[2011/06/28 07:24] Snow Wolfhunter: there are demonstrations in my country as well, same story
[2011/06/28 07:24] Adur Gaelyth: what we can do is of course what Greeks are doing
[2011/06/28 07:25] Sophiekittycat Resident: we have to unite with other movements to talk with others to push to creation of internationals unions
[2011/06/28 07:25] Snow Wolfhunter: dbet to europe, deeper than the ocean, polkliticians corrupted, jailed
[2011/06/28 07:25] David Endrizzi: i said in a political activism forum in facebook that i thought getting arrested for nonviolent felonies in the course of political activism was unwise, and i was asked to leave the group
[2011/06/28 07:25] Adur Gaelyth: what they did in Iceland
[2011/06/28 07:25] Adur Gaelyth: take the streets... overthrow the governments
[2011/06/28 07:25] amadeus Belgar: even unions are being criticised for striking
[2011/06/28 07:25] Adur Gaelyth: but we have to wait until the economic system crumbles
[2011/06/28 07:25] Adur Gaelyth: like in Greece
[2011/06/28 07:26] David Endrizzi: whatever the ideology, its exercise cannot trump common sense
[2011/06/28 07:26] Plot Tracer: well, Snow, here in the UK the Debt is £700m - if the top 2% were to give half of their fortunes to bail the country out - the country would not only be in surplus, but would have enough for new hospitals, schools etc - and the billionaires and millionaires would still be billionaires and millionaires, yet they are shirking their taxes and making the poor/ working pay for the crisis instead.

[2011/06/28 07:26] amadeus Belgar: do we?
[2011/06/28 07:26] amadeus Belgar: yes,,, somehow we dont want to scare them away!
[2011/06/28 07:26] Adur Gaelyth: Where are you from, Snow?
[2011/06/28 07:26] Snow Wolfhunter: nods, i agree, Croatia’s debt is 50 mil euros, a debt young generations will be paying
[2011/06/28 07:26] Snow Wolfhunter: croatia
[2011/06/28 07:27] David Endrizzi: adur, the united states government will not collapse in the way the egyptian government did
[2011/06/28 07:27] Snow Wolfhunter: maybe you know some of our politians? they are in austrian jail at the moment, lol
[2011/06/28 07:27] David Endrizzi: neither, i think, will the British government
[2011/06/28 07:27] Adur Gaelyth: I'm not so sure about that, David
[2011/06/28 07:28] amadeus Belgar: American state is too strong
[2011/06/28 07:28] David Endrizzi: the police state in the united states is much too powerful and well organized
[2011/06/28 07:28] amadeus Belgar: yup
[2011/06/28 07:29] Adur Gaelyth: oh the American State isn't strong at all
[2011/06/28 07:29] Plot Tracer: well - the next country that is predicted to collapse is Spain... and if spain goes, there is nothing to stop the UK economy from collapsing (Ireland on the brink again)

[2011/06/28 07:29] amadeus Belgar: even comes down hard on non violent protests like Israel
[2011/06/28 07:29] Adur Gaelyth: if the big banks collapse, the State will collapse too
[2011/06/28 07:29] David Endrizzi: wher are you adur?
[2011/06/28 07:29] amadeus Belgar: thats what we are told
[2011/06/28 07:29] David Endrizzi: are you familiar with the american police state?
[2011/06/28 07:29] Adur Gaelyth: I'm from the Basque Country
[2011/06/28 07:29] Plot Tracer: nice one adur
[2011/06/28 07:30] Plot Tracer: i have visited Gexto - Algorta
[2011/06/28 07:30] Plot Tracer: a few years back
[2011/06/28 07:30] Adur Gaelyth: you can't have a police state without money
[2011/06/28 07:30] Plot Tracer: indeed
[2011/06/28 07:30] Plot Tracer: or at least, money controlling a militia
[2011/06/28 07:30] Adur Gaelyth: if you can't pay the police anymore,...
[2011/06/28 07:30] amadeus Belgar: good point
[2011/06/28 07:30] Adur Gaelyth: Oh I'm from Getxo! lol
[2011/06/28 07:31] amadeus Belgar: pay police first is good rule
[2011/06/28 07:31] Sophiekittycat Resident: a very good rule i have nothing against cops
[2011/06/28 07:31] Plot Tracer: cool Adur!
[2011/06/28 07:31] David Endrizzi: that's why the police state won't tolerate major disruptions in the working society
[2011/06/28 07:31] Adur Gaelyth: We have lots of things against cops in the Basque Country lol
[2011/06/28 07:31] Sophiekittycat Resident: we not live in police states , we live in corparate states

[2011/06/28 07:32] Sophiekittycat Resident: we still use words from communist and cold war era
[2011/06/28 07:32] David Endrizzi: american police agencies have been busting labor actions since the invention of modern labor actions
[2011/06/28 07:32] Sophiekittycat Resident: we still see the word under 50 years old glasses
[2011/06/28 07:32] Sophiekittycat Resident: the world oops
[2011/06/28 07:32] Adur Gaelyth: I don't believe totalitarian states are possible anymore
[2011/06/28 07:32] amadeus Belgar: coporate,,,,govt and business
[2011/06/28 07:33] Sophiekittycat Resident: totalitarian states still exist but not in europe
[2011/06/28 07:33] Draxtor Despres is Online
[2011/06/28 07:33] Adur Gaelyth: to have a totalitarian state you need a religion or an ideology, like Fascism or Communism or Catolicism or Islam
[2011/06/28 07:33] Anon1 Nino: what about Belarus?
[2011/06/28 07:34] amadeus Belgar: or a good police force
[2011/06/28 07:34] Sophiekittycat Resident: i was meaning european union
[2011/06/28 07:34] David Endrizzi: call it what you will, but if i'm too much a disruption i will be crushed
[2011/06/28 07:34] Anon1 Nino: thats pretty close
[2011/06/28 07:34] Plot Tracer: i kinda agree sophie, though, even in the early 70s, what the communists and socialists and the left spoke about gave great hope. dont you think we need to talk of a new hopeful, tolerent, equitable society?
[2011/06/28 07:34] Adur Gaelyth: you can't run a state by sheer force
[2011/06/28 07:34] Anon1 Nino: oh - yes - a frequent way of defining 'europe'
[2011/06/28 07:35] Snow Wolfhunter: .
[2011/06/28 07:35] Sophiekittycat Resident: no need of sheer force when citizen of sheep minds as long as they have bread and soccer
[2011/06/28 07:35] Adur Gaelyth: you will be crushed if you are alone, David
[2011/06/28 07:35] Sophiekittycat Resident: when citizens have sheep minds
[2011/06/28 07:36] amadeus Belgar: almost there!
[2011/06/28 07:36] Adur Gaelyth: exactly... Sophie, if there is no bread anymore the little sheep will revolt

[2011/06/28 07:36] Snow Wolfhunter: and those who have an opinion are too lazy to do anything
[2011/06/28 07:36] Sophiekittycat Resident: our problem is that the left movemebnts fight each others, that for most people we still talk as were talking stalinists, that people will not fight or strike to help other people
[2011/06/28 07:37] David Endrizzi: i'm only 52, not quite ready to die
[2011/06/28 07:37] Snow Wolfhunter: lol
[2011/06/28 07:37] Adur Gaelyth: we are not lazy... we just have learned that we can't "do" anything
[2011/06/28 07:37] amadeus Belgar: the left could be better organised or even heard in the media a little
[2011/06/28 07:37] Snow Wolfhunter: oh come on. saying that is like saying theres no hope
[2011/06/28 07:37] Laslopantomik Yao: hi everybody!
[2011/06/28 07:38] Adur Gaelyth: the problem of the left is that it's based on ideas
[07:38:02] Plot Tracer: ok - never mind about the wee sects on the left.. or the small infights - what small thing can we do as a group - as an individual to help unfuckitup?
[07:38:13] Sophiekittycat: the political reunions of the biggest political movements in second life bring togethers less people than a small club event
[07:38:39] Sophiekittycat: here is the problem we talk in our nest while teh world continue not knowing us , ignoring us laughing at us
[07:38:56] Farv Hallison: haha
[07:39:07] Sophiekittycat: i call it coffee activism :)
[07:39:19] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): can we demonstrate in public areas?
[07:39:37] Sophiekittycat: question do we have the will to do it ?
[07:39:46] Snow Wolfhunter: nods

[07:40:02] Anon(Anon1): question - when people see 'lefties' marching wil they care?
[07:40:32] Adur Gaelyth: I think we should leave aside all political theories and work from the point of view of simple ethics and humanitarian feelings
[07:40:33] Sophiekittycat: they will care a bit more tha n if they not see us some will know we exist other will laugth
[07:40:38] David Endrizzi: I stumbled into Housman's books, one rainy night 3 years ago in london. i'm too far removed, here in california, to participate with them
[07:40:41] Sophiekittycat: but if we not show we not exist
[07:40:49] Adur Gaelyth: all human beings agree on human feelings
[07:40:50] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): a revolt in SL?
[07:41:00] Snow Wolfhunter: nods
[07:41:06] Sophiekittycat: a revolt no ? not a revolt , education in sl ,
[07:41:08] Anon(Anon1): revolt against?
[07:41:08] Adur Gaelyth: nobody feels it's a good thing that children are dying of hunger
[07:41:21] Melena Mitra: oh no on maybe feels this
[07:41:26] Sophiekittycat: a revolt would be bad , but a growing influence would be nice
[07:41:28] Melena Mitra: but plenty of people like to blame the hungry
[07:41:34] Melena Mitra: and ignore the problems
[07:41:36] Adur Gaelyth: so maybe the most important activism is in the field of information
[07:41:39] Melena Mitra: to live a cosy life
[07:41:45] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): loads of food,,,wrong price
[07:42:04] Anon(Anon1): loads of food - wrong place
[07:42:13] Plot Tracer: i agree re education in sl Sophie
[07:42:22] Adur Gaelyth: for example the guy who made the Inside Job film... that's real activism
[07:42:27] Sophiekittycat: we have to show that we exist, we need to bring more people on our side and we have to show that we are not stalinists escaped from loony bins
[07:43:07] Plot Tracer: well - on the "lefts" message... how we change from the negative "Smash the system" to the positive, "Let's create a better world" - please watch this short video - http://youtu.be/Hzgzim5m7oU
[07:43:12] Snow Wolfhunter: i vote sophie for preseidnt
[07:43:49] Sophiekittycat: lol nahhhhhh not me
[07:45:30] Snow Wolfhunter: god
[07:45:32] Adur Gaelyth: people just need to awaken...

[07:45:45] Adur Gaelyth: well I'm not sure it's a matter of words
[07:46:17] Adur Gaelyth: I don't believe that would happen in rl
[07:46:34] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): very good
[07:46:53] Sophiekittycat: very very good video
[07:47:15] Sophiekittycat: yes it is by the words that we needto fight we not need to conquer lands but to conquer minds
[07:47:17] Adur Gaelyth: do you believe a good slogan can change people's minds?
[07:47:21] Adur Gaelyth: I don't
[07:47:30] Sophiekittycat: it is the problem of the left we are no more making people dream or hope
[07:47:36] Sophiekittycat: i think
[07:47:44] Snow Wolfhunter: yes, i do.. its a simple - if it touches you, youll keep it in mind
[07:47:48] Sophiekittycat: not just a slogan but the way to do it
[07:47:52] Snow Wolfhunter: maybe do something?
[07:48:13] Adur Gaelyth: I think what people need is to see reality
[07:48:14] Sophiekittycat: yes we can of obama , i had a dream of luther, and others
[07:48:31] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): obama?

[07:48:36] Sophiekittycat: they see the reality adur what they need is a dream and hope that they can escape reality
[07:48:39] Adur Gaelyth: for example in that video... 90% of the people wouldn't even look at the beggar
[07:48:46] Plot Tracer: i believe a message of hope - one that sys, we are going to change the world for the better for our kids etc would work better than "smash the system" - smashing anything gives people fear. Lets build a new future... lets have a more positive future... lets do away with greed or something
[07:48:57] Adur Gaelyth: they wouldn't take the trouble of reading his sign
[07:49:03] Snow Wolfhunter: nods
[07:49:28] Snow Wolfhunter: adur, why such pesimisime :/
[07:49:30] Adur Gaelyth: I agree Plot
[07:49:38] Melena Mitra: thanks for the good words plot. we progressives often get mired in an endless critique and there's so many things to solve together. I like the tone of this group conversation today.
[07:49:42] Anon(Anon1): "At Purplefeather we provide powerful, optimised web content to get you noticed online. "
[07:49:44] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): he sells dreams not hopes
[07:49:48] Adur Gaelyth: I'm not a pessimist, on the contrary
[07:49:49] Sophiekittycat: adur you lie to your self you too believe in power of words because you not trust in reallity you said you are from pays basque but pays basque not exist on maps, you trust in the dream of a pays basque
[07:50:07] Plot Tracer: well maybe, Adur, but those who are likely to notice aq beggar may want to try to help him... and perhaps even 1% of those who notice him may want to change a system that allows people to go without...

[07:50:15] Plot Tracer: lol - yes - it is an ad
[07:50:29] Adur Gaelyth: oh the Basque Country is not just a name ツ

[07:50:45] Melena Mitra: yes :))
[07:50:49] Plot Tracer: but the message i think is a good one. take away the negative and change it to a positive and perhaps change takes place
[07:50:54] Sophiekittycat: it is more thana name it is a dream for you
[07:51:00] Adur Gaelyth: I tell you if that beggar was in a poor country like India, people would help him
[07:51:02] Melena Mitra: it is a sovereign entity comprised of hardy and creative people ㋡
[07:51:15] Anon(Anon1): - yes I think Tony Blair would agree with you there
[07:51:19] Sophiekittycat: adur in india they even make work teh children they would not help the beggar
[07:51:23] Anon(Anon1): he was the triumph of style and spin
[07:51:27] Snow Wolfhunter: nods nods
[07:51:28] Sophiekittycat: because the beggar would be an untouchable cast
[07:51:36] Sophiekittycat: he would not be human for most
[07:51:41] Plot Tracer: absolutely - Blair spoke in positive terms in order to further the shite of thatcher
[07:51:49] Melena Mitra: so here is the challenge for progressives
[07:51:50] Adur Gaelyth: ok forget about India lol
[07:52:12] Melena Mitra: when that beggar's right to sit their and ask for humanity's kind eyes to fall on him is taken away by the government

[07:52:19] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): grab the liberal agenda and make it a left one
[07:52:19] Melena Mitra: we can respond
[07:52:22] Melena Mitra: and challenge the laws
[07:52:28] Melena Mitra: and the community mindset
[07:52:37] Adur Gaelyth: but the problem is in people minds... they have been abducted by consumerism
[07:52:38] Melena Mitra: that wants to eradicate the message and the person
[07:52:41] Melena Mitra: but not solve the problem
[07:52:53] Sophiekittycat: yes we need to fight on the mind battlefield
[07:53:03] Sophiekittycat: we need to be the new dream
[07:53:06] Plot Tracer: i think we can learn from that - without lying - we can be more positive than smashing things - actually - when i go to various left rallies and protests i see more positive, building and comradery than i do "smashing" - it is the comradery and positive building in both relationships and physical space we should concentrate on
[07:53:09] Melena Mitra: not on the mind battlefield
[07:53:16] Melena Mitra: on the concrete daily living field
[07:53:16] Sophiekittycat: it is why hiding in a coffee between us is near useless

[07:53:17] Adur Gaelyth: they won't help people in need because they think they need to buy a new car or a new house or a new TV set to be happy
[07:53:27] Melena Mitra: yes
[07:53:31] Plot Tracer: yes sophie - the new dream
[07:53:40] Plot Tracer: or the new future
[07:53:41] Melena Mitra: and they don't want to have their consciouses bothered by seeing a poor blind person as they do it

[07:53:49] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): a more equal dream
[07:53:50] Sophiekittycat: melena people stay as sheep because they fight on the concrete daily tehy not strike for others because they need bread for themselves
[07:54:00] Sophiekittycat: what make people move is hope
[07:54:10] Sophiekittycat: and hope not exist in concrete daily life
[07:54:36] Maya Lockjaw is Online
[07:54:37] Melena Mitra: some do
[07:54:37] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): elections should provide hope each time
[07:54:44] Melena Mitra: but most of us here have a little more liberty
[07:54:50] Melena Mitra: to fight for others
[07:54:55] Melena Mitra: and share our good fortune with others too
[07:54:59] Melena Mitra: the fact that we're here chating
[07:55:00] Adur Gaelyth: the real revolution will happen in people's minds
[07:55:05] Melena Mitra: using pcs
[07:55:07] Melena Mitra: is evidence of that
[07:55:14] Adur Gaelyth: in fact I believe it's already happening now
[07:55:22] Plot Tracer took a snapshot
[07:55:23] Anon(Anon1): and when the internet is censored and controlled?
[07:55:29] Sophiekittycat: melena we are what less than 10 people at each reunion ?
[07:55:30] Adur Gaelyth: people are looking for happiness
[07:55:32] Anon(Anon1): like where I live?

[07:55:36] Sophiekittycat: it is proof that we are invisible
[07:56:05] Melena Mitra: but it is 10 people
[07:56:08] Melena Mitra: that can do something
[07:56:13] Melena Mitra: I don't care if I'm invisible or not

[07:56:27] Farv Hallison: http://front.moveon.org/scribbling-sharpie-illustrates-the-truth-about-our-economy/?id=28084-1824006-v%3DNhaAx

[07:56:27] Sophiekittycat: what can we do if we stay here ?
[07:56:28] Melena Mitra: it's what I do to respond to the inequities around me
[07:56:30] Melena Mitra: that counts
[07:56:41] Melena Mitra: we can choose 1 issue
[07:56:44] Melena Mitra: that is affecting someone in rl

[07:56:50] Melena Mitra: and use our brains and resources
[07:56:53] Melena Mitra: to tackle it
[07:56:58] Melena Mitra: and offer a solution
[07:57:14] Melena Mitra: then we can take that example
[07:57:22] Melena Mitra: and make it known to others
[07:57:27] Master Amadeus (amadeus.belgar): ok
[07:57:27] Melena Mitra: so they can replicate and adapt it in other places
[07:59:18] Plot Tracer: i think there seems to be a mass crash going on... i had a mini crash lol
[07:59:27] Plot Tracer: i cant see anyone - who is here?
[07:59:58] Farv Hallison: I can see you.
[08:00:02] Plot Tracer: cool
[08:00:04] Plot Tracer: soz
[08:00:13] Plot Tracer: people are materialising again lol
[08:00:39] Plot Tracer: hey - as is customary at these meets - two things - can i place the chatlog on www.slleftunity.com and

[08:00:54] Farv Hallison: http://fora.tv/2009/02/13/Dmitry_Orlov_Social_Collapse_Best_Practices

[08:01:01] Plot Tracer: would everyone liike to address the discussion subject in one last paragraph?
[08:01:25] Plot Tracer: also - any suggestions for next tuesdays discussion - please pass me on a notecard anytime
[08:01:28] Anon(Anon1): don't like my name on chatlogs
[08:01:43] Plot Tracer: no probs - i can take your name off Anon1
[08:01:48] Anon(Anon1): thanks
[08:01:56] Adur Gaelyth: I don't mind Plot ツ
[08:04:27] Adur Gaelyth: I like your idea of taking a more positive approach, Plot
[08:05:03] Plot Tracer: ok - my last paragraph - I think the young people - the youth who have not lived through the fall of communism or through the resulting sectionalisation of the left, can change the world and push the world towards a more positive future. UKUNCUT and USUNCUT is being mirrored here in SL with SL UNCUT - groups of people shouting for a more positive future and an equitable society where people pay their way and help those who need help to be picked up off the ground.

[08:05:16] Plot Tracer: The future is ours! :)

[08:05:56] Adur Gaelyth: Yes it is ours ツ

[2011/06/28 08:09] Plot Tracer: ok - uless anyone else has a few sentences they would like to say, i'll call an end to the meeting :)
[2011/06/28 08:09] Plot Tracer: nice meeting some of you new comrades... :)

[2011/06/28 08:10] Adur Gaelyth: The system we live in is based on fear and lies... and each new generation of people has less fear than the one before, and each day it's getting more and more difficult for politicians to make people believe their lies...

[2011/06/28 08:10] Adur Gaelyth: Sorry, Plot, I type so slowly lol
[2011/06/28 08:10] Adur Gaelyth: Nice meeting you ツ
[2011/06/28 08:11] Plot Tracer: sorry adur lol - i wasnt sure if u wanted to add something :) it was good to meet u

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